#149 Shane Nicholson
In 2019 Rae Leigh went to the DAG singer songwriter retreat where Shane Nicholson was one of the mentors and they got paired up to write a song together called 'Powered By Love'. Shane has been recording and releasing his own music since the 1990's and has worked with some amazing artists including Kasey Chambers.
With over 10 million streams to date on previously released material, the writing process for Shane’s latest offering played out a little differently. Instead of taking himself off to a remote location (his usual writing process) most were written in borrowed houses nearby on the Central Coast, and as a result of Song Club - the online writing community set up by Nashville-based expat Sam Hawksley, whereby songwriters have to produce and post a new song every week. The recording process for ‘Living In Colour’ also played out differently to his last albums, where he previously worked with his good mate and multi-award winning producer Matt Fell.
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Transcript
Rae Leigh: All right. Welcome to a songwriter with Shane Nicholson. Thank you very much for joining me.
Shane Nicolson: Thanks for having me.
Rae Leigh: So I like to start this podcast simply by getting you to share with us a little bit about who you are and where you come from.
Shane Nicolson: who I am. I come from Queensland. I was born in red cliff. I grew up in Brisbane and Queensland, uh, still Um, even though I'm anywhere near the state at the moment.
Um, I live in I'm in the middle of the leper colony, just north of Sydney at the moment. Uh, Wales for most of my adult life. Um, and playing music in Brisbane with a high school band that ended up becoming a. career band. And after about 11 years of that, I kind of felt like it was time to go out on my own and do a solo thing.
And it started off as a side project to the band, but it kind of quickly took over because I, uh, songwriter in the band days, There was something great about not having to have a pretend democracy when it came to the songs and how I would record them. And I liked having complete control.
So it was like a drug that got me and I couldn't go back to the band thing after that. So I just kept with it and um, solo records and then the band just kind of fell apart, I think. And I was just enjoying the freedom so much, you know, and, and being able to write your songs and record them the way you want is a, beautiful thing.
Rae Leigh: Yeah, I've definitely heard, um, some people really like the whole band vibe and other really liked the solo thing.
And, um, I think it's a journey. Every artist has to go on to work what's a better fit for them.
Shane Nicolson: Yeah, I think exactly. Everyone's different.
And I do love the comradery of a band and I've still got a band now, the differences I employ them all. So they still have to do what I say when I say so I'm still
Rae Leigh: You want to be the bus?
Shane Nicolson: Yeah. I still get to be in control. The funny thing is now I asked for their opinions more, you know, maybe because I don't have to, you know, um, and everyone in my band is a record producer They're all much more talented than I am. So I, um, I take their, uh, on board all
Rae Leigh: That's a good way to have it. Have people who are better than you around you
Shane Nicolson: Absolutely.
Rae Leigh: can't help. Right. Do anything but help. So tell me, let's go back to the beginning. started, when you were quite young, where did the music bug kind of catch you? What was it? Was there inspiration or how did you meet music?
Shane Nicolson: it was through my parents, I guess like a lot of people, um, not, not that they were musicians, we weren't a musical household as far as playing music, or we didn't have family singalongs or anything like that.
Rae Leigh: Mm.
Shane Nicolson: was a musical loving household. We listened to music all the time. There was always a record playing, uh, when I was younger and it was kind of two distinct record collections.
My, my dad's collection and my mom's. And, um, there was a bit of a crossover stylistically they had their own records that they always played. And yeah. Liked. And so I kind of got into folk music through my mom. Who's listening to Dylan and Joan Baez, Donovan, things like that. And then, and that kind of crossed over to my dad's world.
He was more rock and roll little stuff, rockabilly, um, country. And, but then there was a crossover in the middle way. He listened to things like a bread and Donovan as well, and where the folk thing joined the pop and the rock world. And.
Rae Leigh: Yep.
Shane Nicolson: I kind of found myself navigating between all of those things, you know?
Those sounds are what still inform my decisions to this day. They're the ones that made the impression on me. And, but it wasn't until I heard, uh, Neil Young's harvest record that I first that's when I first realized that, oh, there's a man behind the music here. There's a guy that's writing these songs.
About stories that matter to him. They're not just songs to be on the radio. These are stories of his life. And then he's recording them. He's pulling a band together. He's an artist like this is a guy that's creating something, you know? And so that record, it was Neil Young's harvest. And also Dillon's times they are a change in those two albums were what made me pick up a guitar and try and write songs long before I'd learned how to play one.
I couldn't even really tune it, but I was trying to write songs on there. You know, before I had any idea what I was doing, but I, I think it was the idea that I could be creative. There was an outlet here. There was, this is a way for me to express something and that's what appealed to me about it more than anything.
Rae Leigh: Very cool. Yeah, it's a, it's a great outlet. What were you sort of identifying with, do you think at that stage of your life, What were you needed to like
outlet through your music?
Shane Nicolson: think I needed one as such, because I had a pretty normal and, and good child, uh, uh, Exactly. Yeah. I mean, not to brag, but you know, I didn't have anything I had to kind of, you know, get out or deal with in a therapeutic or cathartic way. I, I think I was just emulating, Kelly, most of the time in writing about things that he'd probably written about, you know, and it was, I was only young and I was still trying to figure out Um, had I even make music let say. So, um, I'm really not that liked the idea of being able to make something that didn't exist before. And I loved, I love to recording. I started recording myself really early on. So the bug of actually putting something to tape, making it real.
That got me really early on. And I was doing the old, you know, two ghetto blasters side by side and you record on one and then you play along with that and recorded on the other one. And it's like, and then flip the tapes over and do it again. And, and it was like, Foray into a multi-track multi-track recording, you know, and, uh, a lot of people start that way and, uh, it was, yeah, I think it just, it was, it was kind of everything at once.
It was the idea that I could write a song I could record. It could exist on tape and it didn't exist that morning. And that's what got me. And that's what still gets me though. That's exactly why I get up and go to work every day in the studio. That's exactly why. And I would trade every other aspect of the industry, everything too, to just be able to do that, you know, like that, that's the thing I love the most.
Rae Leigh: The creativity,
Shane Nicolson: Yeah,
Rae Leigh: making something
Shane Nicolson: making some, being new that wasn't there before, you know, it feels really good. And, um, I mean, it's weird to think about the fact that it'll it'll last forever, long after you're gone. And so it's, I try not to think about that because it puts on to undue pressure on it, but, um, it's also kind of cool at the same time. I've been one of these people that I I've never been able to keep a journal or a diary or anything like that. Cause I'm just not, I guess, disciplined enough, but this is my 12th record now that I'm releasing. And when you look back on them, they cover 22 years of music and you go, oh, well it kind of.
They are journals in a way, you know, so they can take me back to every, every single point in my life when each of those, those records happened or each song happened, you know? And so they kind of, I like, I liked journals. Yeah,
Rae Leigh: Yeah, they follow this sort of the story of your life. And, you know, as you evolve and change. so will your music and that's quite a natural, um, journey
for an artist. Do, Do you remember the first song? that you ever wrote?
Shane Nicolson: Yeah, it was called, it was called a little one and I don't know why or what it was about. I remember the chorus was little one. What you crying for? Something like that? I don't know if I was singing about my baby sister or, or a girlfriend I'd never had. Cause I was like 12, you know, so I don't know what I was singing about, but I do remember it and it's always stuck in my head.
I mean, there's been a lot of songs I've written that I would never remember just rubbish, but for some reason that was always just stayed with me. Like, okay. I don't know, maybe. Cause it was the first one, you know, and I did actually work on it like a song. Like I came back to it the next day and did a bit more and did a bit more.
Yeah. I now know what the chords were that I was trying to play. I didn't know them then, but I now know, like I can figure it out, you know? So yeah, it was, there's no danger of it being recorded and released or anything like that,
but I've got it in my, you know, it's in my
memory catalog. Yeah.
Rae Leigh: Yeah.
So speaking of like song and how. how it evolves for you, what, what is your process? Do you try to get a song done in, you know, three hours? Do you like to co-write
what's your
Shane Nicolson: Fundamental different. I find that I don't really have a process. And, um, the question I've probably been asked the most in my life is, you know, what, how do you start a song? What comes first musical lyrics? And the, I don't have an answer for that because they're all different. Yeah. I actually can't even identify the best way for me to do it.
I just go with whatever I've got and sometimes it's a lyrics. Sometimes it's music. Sometimes it's just that I've got an hour spare and I've got no idea and I'll sit down and try. And sometimes the muse doesn't show up and sometimes she does. And I'm getting better at dealing with that. That when I was younger, I used to believe it was called writer's block, but I don't believe there's any such thing as writer's block now, just there's time between, um, there's just, it's just time between inspirations and when you're feeling like it, and it always comes back.
I've learned that over the years. So I just try not to stress.
If you do an hour and you don't write anything, it's never a wasted hour because there's a bunch of stuff you've just worked through that you don't have to
work through again. So I find nothing's anytime you spend, trying to write is never wasted, even if you don't get anything out of it.
Rae Leigh: yeah, you never know what the real seeds are of what you've gotten out of that session. That's really good.
When, When, you
are
writing and maybe specifically for . a project or an album,
Shane Nicolson: Um,
Rae Leigh: Or just in general, do you have like a core idea of what you want people to get from your songs or the feelings that you want people to pick up on or an idea of your audience?
Shane Nicolson: I know this is going to sound kind of selfish, I guess, in a way, but I never ever think of anybody listening to songs when I'm writing them. Um, it does creep into the recording process because as a producer for other people, it's just kind of. Part of what you have to do, you know, is to try and translate these songs into something that's going to be listened to on a wider level.
And what's the best way to do that. But as a writer, I almost never think about anybody else. Um, and I've been really. I've staunchly kept to that rule over the years, because I don't want to ever edit myself for the sake of another person or other people or listeners or anything. So I write purely for myself and my own enjoyment and my own fulfillment.
And I'm okay with that because I'm a pretty tough critic. And if I can impress myself with a song, then that's all I really need to do. So it's kind of a self. Adventure I go on, but, but that's what songwriting is anyway. That's why I often.
Rae Leigh: Okay.
Shane Nicolson: Since I, I used to ride on the road when, you know, in my twenties and I was always on the road touring and I would brought in hotel rooms and airplanes and to have buses and all that kind of stuff.
And I, I felt like I was getting somewhere running every day and it was good to be creative, but then that changes and I had started having kids and then they were coming on the road and there wasn't as much time to ride on the road. And then there, you weren't riding at home. I don't ride at home very often because.
I got my studio, um, kind of attached to my house. So I it's sort of like work there as well, so I don't really ride it home. So over the last few albums, I've developed a system where I would go somewhere, uh, isolated, a new, usually somewhere with no phone service. Far away from anyone I knew and I would go and
Rae Leigh: It's a dag.
Shane Nicolson: yeah, well, today's a good place for that.
It's a good place for that. But, um, I went out to the red center for the hell breaks, loose record. I went and found a house on the Hawkesbury river that you could only get to by boat on the love and blood record. And I, I just would isolate myself in these places and write and. Because if I need to be in a space where I can just suspend reality and be selfish and all self-absorbed enough to just lock down into my own head and, and right.
And so I would need to go somewhere where life doesn't infiltrate your space, you know, so that's what I was doing. The last couple of albums. And that's been my, my process. I guess if I do have a process, that's been it.
Rae Leigh: Yeah.
Shane Nicolson: Obviously that didn't work with this record cause I couldn't travel anywhere. So, um, it had to, I had to find a new approach this time
around.
Rae Leigh: Yeah. What did you do this time around? Cause you've gone into lockdown and It's hopefully that's not a COVID cough, but
Shane Nicolson: It's not sorry.
Rae Leigh: what was going
on.
Shane Nicolson: Um, okay. So this time around, I was just really fortunate that I. I, uh, I got, uh, my mate, Sam Hawksley from, uh, he's an Aussie that lives in Nashville has been there for decades now. And he started up a song club in Australia with some friends. So it was just a, a secret kind of group where, uh, we would write songs.
The rule was you had to write a new song every year. To a prompt. And we were kind of an offshoot to the Nashville song club that he was part of. So then he would pass on the prompt to us and there was about, or 10 of us, all artists in Australia. And, um, it was just a small group and yeah. He would give us a prompt each week and you had to write and deliver a song every week.
Um, and besides him giving you one chance you, if you miss that deadline you're out. So he was, he was really full on about it.
Rae Leigh: Yeah. Catch you accountable.
Shane Nicolson: yeah. And he had a white list of yeah. Long of other people that wanted to join the clubs. So everyone was trying to not be the one that
got kicked out.
Um,
Rae Leigh: Did anyone get.
Shane Nicolson: I think maybe someone did, I there's none of the original group there anymore.
We all left. I th I think, but I think we all
stayed until we got enough
songs to put on
records and then we,
Rae Leigh: Okay. And that is a difference when you're a writer and an artist is like, once you've got enough songs, you want to move on to the next process of
getting it out there. Don't you.
Shane Nicolson: totally. But I also got like tired of the pressure having to do it every week. Oh, I got, cause I'm a terrible time management, uh, person. I I'm a crammer from high school days. So our songs we'll always do Thursday night, you know, midnight,
I would always start at 11 o'clock an hour before it was due because I just hadn't planned for it.
And it was pretty much I was doing it so I didn't get kicked out or shamed by the group. And so I would do a song really quickly and submit it. But it turns out that about four of the five, four or five songs off this new record were song club songs that I wrote. So it actually, it forced, yeah, it forced me to arrive at a time that I wouldn't normally have written.
I was producing a lot at the time. And didn't have much downtime. I was stuck at home with lockdowns. We couldn't travel to go somewhere. So it's a time that I wouldn't normally have written at all. So Sam's song club kind of forced me. Right. And it also forced me to write quickly because I. It was cramming everything.
And it wasn't really, I mean, no, for one, for one of a better term. I wasn't trying that hard. I mean, I was trying hard to write songs, but I, I wasn't really putting the, uh, placing the importance on it that I normally would if I was writing a record. So a lot of these songs just fell out really quickly and easily, you know?
And, um, it's been a pretty fruitful club actually, because there's the whole. Josh, uh, Josh Cunningham
and Felicity haircuts entire
album
is called, which is called song club. The entire album was Lee was written in the song club.
Oh,
Rae Leigh: That's classic. I love that. So is there one that you specifically have on the album, that you're like that one, you know, was one that I wasn't expecting to sort of
be anything.
Shane Nicolson: Oh, there's more than that. There's more like there's three or four that I thought just, it wouldn't be anything that was song club ones that, um, just stuck around and hung around, you know? Um, uh, there's a song called where in the world, which I wrote seriously in like less than 20 minutes because I was facing deadline and that's kind of why short.
So I put it, I put it towards the end of the record, but, but then it's beautiful too. It's also something I normally probably wouldn't have written if I. Um, wasn't just going on a whim with, with an hour up my sleeve, you know, uh, there's a plenty of them. There's plenty of songs like that. I ain't been loved.
There's a lot of songs that kind of. Ideas that I'd had that sometimes the song club prompt brought to me and then I thought, oh, okay. I've been thinking about a song like this and this could work. So
Rae Leigh: Hmm.
Shane Nicolson: it, it really, really helped. It was really good. And I think I might just join again up, like it's still going and I might join up again when I need some more songs, you know?
Rae Leigh: Yeah. Cool. And what about collaboration and corroding? Have you done? I mean, I know we did that retreat at the deck, but I mean, is that something that you
prefer or enjoy
doing or
Shane Nicolson: Yeah. We've written together. Uh, I've written with a few Britain with few people, obviously mostly at the dag. I do lots of my collabs there, but I don't really. Collaborate on songwriting that much outside of the deck. Um, there is a song on this record that I wrote at the dag, uh, which is high process advising that I wrote with Leon Milner at the dag, uh, And it's about the first cover us first.
Co-write I've released in like 15 years or something. Like I just don't really do that much. Co-writing um, certainly not for my projects. I've done a bit, a fair bit of it over the years for other people or publishes might send. Which I quite like riding with a younger new artists that they've just signed, who are still trying to find their way.
I love doing that. And I've done quite a bit of that stuff over the years, but less and less as time goes on. Um, so yeah. I actually really enjoy it. There's nothing better than when you're in a, a great co-writer and the sparks are flying and everything's setting every idea sets off another one. It's a really cool feeling.
It's like a runaway train, you know, and I love
that. Um, but it's, you know, that's, that's what, that's the elusive thing you searching for? When you sit down to write a song with
anyone.
Rae Leigh: W what is it, do you think that is sort of makes you want to just do your own thing? Like, is there an extra level of vulnerability or you feel like you like to struggle to sort of be open with your
co-writers
Shane Nicolson: Um, I don't think I struggle with that. I think I just enjoy what I get out of it more when I'm doing it on my own. Like it's the, it's a personal like, process for me. And it's never a means to an end. It's always about doing it too. Like I get as much enjoyment from the process of writing it. As I do from having it finished, it's about the process for me.
And sometimes it's, it's psychotic or it's therapeutic or it's, um, satisfying. And, and I don't feel
those things as strongly when I'm collaborating. I feel the more when I'm working on my own. And
I think that's why I gravitate towards that
more often.
Rae Leigh: I think I'm going to have to
adopt your process of just I'm going to the middle of nowhere with no reception, because I think that's the main reason I went to the day. It was mainly Just to get away.
and have a break. And then the fact that music was involved as well was just an absolute
bonus.
Shane Nicolson: Look, it's an, it's an amazing thing. When you can wake up one morning and just get out of bed and think I don't have to do anything today. Think about this song I'm writing, you know, like you don't have to pay a bill, answer a phone, um, feed a child. There's nothing in it. It's a really good feeling. And it's, that's when I find that all the, all the barriers just fall and all the ideas are ready to come, because there's nothing that you try.
Squeezing around. You're not trying to, you know, be creative in and around some busy life. And I find it's just such a, it's such a great space to be in. You can open whiskey at 12:00 PM. If
you want to, you know, lunchtime and you're allowed to, if
you're picking, if you're playing a banjo, you can open whiskey even earlier in the morning.
you know,
it's
just, it just goes
Rae Leigh: That's a requirement. Isn't it
Shane Nicolson: Yeah.
Rae Leigh: What about, um, cause you have been doing this quite a long time. Um, what do you think is sort of the, the basis behind
your continued efforts? Like what's kept you in the industry for so long? Cause it's, it's got a, quite a high turnover. This industry.
Shane Nicolson: Yeah, it does, obviously. I think, well, it depends how much you want it and how much you want to stick around. I think. A lot of people could stick around more if they wanted to. It's just that people's priorities change and artists don't want to,
or they want to move into another area or they don't want to fight that fight anymore or whatever it is.
So I I'm only still there because I just
didn't
go away. Like it's
Rae Leigh: Yeah.
Shane Nicolson: it's not,
like, um, it's not like I haven't had plenty of reasons to leave or walk away from it over the years. It's not always been, you know, roses. I've also been really lucky and I've pretty much achieved just about every dream I had as a teenager, growing up to be a musician.
I've pretty much done almost all of the things I ever wanted to do. So everything beyond that is just gravy now. And I, um, I think it's too late. It's gotten to the point where I can't do anything else. So I just got to make it work. You know, I, um, I don't think I'd want to start anything else. I just love it too much.
I enjoy it. And that's probably the answer. I just love it and I enjoy it and I get it kind of makes me feel complete, you know, or hole or something. And I,
when I'm not doing it, I, I feel exactly like incomplete doesn't something's missing, you know? So I think
that's really the end.
Rae Leigh: What was the moment in your career where you kind Of,
had to pinch yourself and go, okay, I've reached these goals that
you had. You said when
Shane Nicolson: oh, there's so
many or so many, so many, like, and some of them are like ones that just wouldn't matter to anyone else. You know, little things, you know, like I'm sitting in a studio in, in London, mixing a record, you know, when I was 22 or something. And, you know, I had a full on goosebumps moment when it all kind of came to me.
Yeah. Wow, halfway around the world. I'm making a record by a major label deal. And I'm about to get on two or three, you know, through the U S and it was, was, that was a pinch me moment. Wouldn't matter to anyone else, because it was just this private kind of moment at the back of a studio in the dark. You know, at 2:00 AM, but then there's also been those classic ones where you standing on stage next to one of your
idols, you know, singing and you
think, you know, how did this happen?
How did I get here from Redcliffe? You know, it's really, really weird.
Rae Leigh: I think it's what happens when you're busy. Just doing what you love. I think those are those moments kind of just happen. You don't actually really have to do much just
manifest, say.
Shane Nicolson: Yeah. Sometimes they fall in your lap.
Rae Leigh: Yeah. Like sometimes a guy just picks your name out of a bucket and you end up writing a song together. Um,
tell me that's what happened. Um,
I'm like, who's this guy. Um,
tell me
about,
I guess your best and worst advice you've ever been given in this career.
Hmm.
Shane Nicolson: Well, most of the advice you get given is the worst advice because nobody really, nobody really knows anything. And that's, that's the truth is that people are experienced and they've learned things from experience, but it's such a volatile, rapidly changing industry. Nobody really knows anything definitive, you know?
Um, so you can get advice from people. I. Believed. And I don't know whether I was told this at one stage or I made it up, but I've always believed that you listen to all the advice that's on offer and believe none of it. So, but what I mean by that is you take it all on board, but don't believe any of it to be gospel truth.
And you just kind of make up your own mind once you've heard it all, you know, and no one's going to be there for the whole 30 year run of your career.
Like it's going to be your, the, you, you're the one person that's going to be there the whole time. So it has to come back to you. You have to kind of.
Except responsibility for that, you know? So I think, yeah, there's, oh, there's always people there will, there will always be people more experienced and it's good to take on all of their learnings over the years and then make up your own mind. And how does it, how does it relate to you? You know, but I don't think there's any one person that could, um, you know, uh, give you all the answers and, uh, you know, it's, it's, it's, it's kind of like, I think it's like a growing or Ganek thing that has to happen over the years.
You get bits of advice, you get bits of experience and then you get some more and that leads you to another place. And then you get some more advice and some more experience. And
lots of times in the music industry, it's learning what not to do, not so much what you, what you need to do. It's like something doesn't work.
You
think I go, well, I'm not
doing that again.
Rae Leigh: it really does come down to
experience. Doesn't it.
Shane Nicolson: time there's not yet, there's not much of a. A way to get around that, um, time and experience, but also champions you'll always have champions in your corner and they make all the difference, you know, and trying to use that to your advantage. And it's always really good to have a long memory too, because there'll be a lot of people that walk all over you in the earlier days.
And
then without doubt, if you stick around long enough, You'll be paying them one day and I've noticed that happens so
many times
with,
Rae Leigh: do you mean you'd be
paying
Shane Nicolson: well, you'll be employing them somehow, you know, and that's kind of happened to me so many times, and I remember those earliest things and it's not about revenge. It's about, um, it's about it almost kind of like.
Rae Leigh: okay.
Shane Nicolson: Justifying your, uh, your persistence or something and you feel like, um, okay, uh, I've, I've achieved something here, you know, I've done something and, um, I think, yeah, you stick around long enough and, um, you'll eventually kind of. Be that person that has the experience and the advice and, and look, I'm always happy to offer advice to people now, but I'm the first one to say, don't
take it to heart.
What the fuck and hell do I know? You know, like it's just, I'm just one person is luck through it. So, you know,
Rae Leigh: Yeah. Absolutely. And it is one of those things, especially these days I'm finding with COVID like everything's changed and we're all kind of, no one knows what to do next. Um, we were all guessing, so we just gotta see what happens. What, what about, and let's just have a little bit less good time traveling.
So you go back and you meet yourself. Um, Now as an adult, you meet yourself as a, a kid, you know, in red cliff, somewhere in Brisbane. And you had a few minutes to give yourself a piece of advice. What would you say to yourself?
Shane Nicolson: I don't take yourself so seriously. It would be the F the first thing I would say, cause, uh,
Rae Leigh: Okay.
Shane Nicolson: I think I should have. Enjoyed the start of the journey more, um, all through my twenties, you know, I was just living on the road and constantly touring mostly overseas and which is great and enjoyable. But you.
Part of that process is that you are consistently living in the future. You're consistently planning the next thing what's what's going to happen. Where is this going to leverage me to the next thing? What country can we release in next? You know, um, you're, you're always live. In tomorrow and not really taking much stock of what you're doing at the time, you know?
And so I would, I would say just chill a bit and enjoy joy because you're going to wake
up and, and be 40, you know, and then you've, you've toured the world 10 times, but you don't really remember anything, you know So that's what I
would say.
Rae Leigh: Enjoy the journey. Absolutely. Because you never know when the journey is going to wait and try it. So you might as well just enjoy it
while you're in it.
Shane Nicolson: Absolutely. Yeah. That's something that I see, I think more about now, I guess, with getting older and having lost our friend, Glen Hannah, or a couple of years ago. Those you think about the, the mortality and how the journey could stop. And I think it's something that I wouldn't have thought about in my twenties, obviously, or even my thirties, but it's something you think about more,
the older you get and
you kind of want to make the most of
every everything you're doing now, you know, I've certainly feel that
way.
Rae Leigh: Yeah, certainly. All right. If this is another fun one, if you
could co-write or just collaborate even with anyone in the world, dead or alive, who would it be
and why?
Shane Nicolson: uh, well, this is tricky. This one, because, you know, I could easily say one of my heroes, Neil young, or Nick cave or something, Nick cave, you know, but I actually probably wouldn't if that opportunity came up, I, I think
that would be just a step too far. I don't think I would want. Put myself in that situation, which I told, I
mean,
I remember, I
Rae Leigh: No want to meet your
Shane Nicolson: yeah, I remember years ago, Paul McCartney asking Neil Finn to co-write and Neil Finn said no, and it, because he's like, that's his, um, he's, he's he's idle.
And I get, I understand completely. I think that story is true. I heard that years
ago. I'm exactly the same. I would probably have to say no to Neil young, but I think. I think if I could work with anyone, it would be more, not so much co-writing maybe, maybe it would be, but it would just be in a creative sense in a room, in a studio, writing, recording, playing me.
That's a good question. I think maybe Lisa Hannigan is someone that I'd love to work with out of everyone. And she. Just so amazing. Uh, so in all of, kind of everything she does, and I would love to just sit with a blank canvas in a studio with her, you know, um, but there's, I could listen. So many people like that, um, that I, I admire, you know, and, um, I think,
uh, geez, my, my brain's going crazy now with all these different names, but that'll just start too many stories.
If I do that.
Rae Leigh: That's all right. All right. Well,
I'm sure you have a lot of stories to share with us. Is there anything, um,
that you want to share
as
far as, um, like a story that comes to mind, that you go actually,
like that one? The moment that has defined a lot of my career.
Shane Nicolson: I think, I don't know if I've had one moment, you know, I think it's been a collection of moments. I haven't had like that breakthrough moment where everything changes in the next day. You wake up and you're breaking in the dough and on. On a world tour and everything's changed. I haven't had that. I've had lots of little victories that just get bigger and bigger and bigger, and they snowball, you know, there's moments I can pinpoint, you know, the, the first time you stand on stage as a kid, I watched them every year at what's the aria awards and see, you know, John Farnham winning 10 of them.
And yeah.
Always imagining that one day, I'd love to go to the aria woods, you know, imagine winning one and then you win one and you stand there and that
you can't escape the idea that, of the feeling that holy hell, I used to watch this as a kid and imagine that, and then
you do
it, you know, that's there's
Rae Leigh: Now you're inspiring other kids, you know?
Shane Nicolson: Yeah. And there's moments like that, which are cool. And they stick out a bit at pivotal, but they're still in the grand scheme of things, kind of small moments in your career that add up to bigger ones, you know, like, um, just some of the most important things in, in a career are quite boring. Things that happen behind the scenes.
Um, they're the things that will springboard you to bigger things. And I think it's just all about, I fully believe it's all about little victories that, that build up to bigger one, you know, to, to remain victory, which is just to keep having a career. And that
is a victory in my mind, just to have a career is the definition of it.
Rae Leigh: Yeah,
Shane Nicolson: absolutely.
Rae Leigh: Very cool. All right. So, um, what have you got, like, I know that you're in lockdown
and I heard that there was a double the cases as only today. So I don't know when lockdown is going to finish for you guys, but do you have many plans for the rest of this year? Have you got
shows
or tours booked or anything?
Yeah,
Shane Nicolson: Well, we, we had
a
Rae Leigh: feel weird asking this question. Sorry.
Shane Nicolson: we had a, you know, an album tour, obviously that's not happening now. And, uh, It's just a lot of dates that we, that my poor managers trying to reschedule.
Um, and it's the second time we've already rescheduled them once before, you know, so I think, I think I'm resigned to the fact that it's going to be a while I'm kind of a, it's going to be a while till the tour happens, but.
In lieu of doing that, I've actually just, I'm going to be in the studio producing and just keep doing what I'm doing. I'm lucky I can still make music. There's still people that want to work remotely. We're making a lot of remote albums at the moment with artists that can't travel. So we're doing it via the internet and it's, there's still people making music.
So. Even though I'm not going to be on tour. And it, it pains me to not take these new songs on the road and have my, my boys in the band back out on the road with me. I haven't seen him and made it. We haven't made noise together in quite a while. So, um, despite all of that, I'm still very lucky that I'll be working at least and, and working, doing something I love.
So I think it's going to be probably studio work for most of the year and then, and trying to get out to shows once, once we can. Turn the ship around a little bit, but yeah, you're right. We hit, we hit our worst point
today. We,
Rae Leigh: Well, let's hope it doesn't get any
worse, but you never know
Shane Nicolson: at west point so far. Yeah.
So it's w we're not, we're not turning the ship around yet.
So the trick though I think is for musicians is to, is to stay positive.
Keep rescheduling the shows, um, because it's great. It's always good to have something to look forward to for musicians and for fans and for people who want to see shows it, they still want to buy tickets. We're still, you know, the tour was selling really good and people weren't even sure if the shows would happen.
So they're optimistic about wanting to get out too. So I think the trick is to just keep planning for it. We'll just keep shifting them back if it happens, but.
Keep planning that the music is going to
come back, you know? So that's what we're
hoping for.
Rae Leigh: Yep. And big thank you to the
managers and all
Shane Nicolson: Oh my God.
Rae Leigh: putting in all the effort to have to do that because it is it's a million times the work
than it used to be
for the same money.
Shane Nicolson: It's
well, and for a lot of them, it's, it's less money than normal because the last few years their artists haven't been making any money. So you've got managers all around the place that are working for peanuts now, just to kind of keep their artists alive during the. Time. So a lot of them are working twice as hard for TA if you know, for half as much.
And, um, I, yeah, it's, it's one job I could not do right now. Um, I take my hat off to all of the managers out there and promote as,
especially as, you know, promoters managers, anyone trying to fight that fight booking agents
are, the
list goes on. Yeah.
Rae Leigh: Yeah, it's, it's such a team effort and I've always, um, more and more find the whole individual artists or independent artists like that whole term, such as like a a cloud, because it's like, it actually takes so many people to pull off, Like just even a single you know, I don't know
why they say independent because it it should be the opposite of that.
It's like collaborative, uh,
artists,
Shane Nicolson: Yeah, well, it is. Yeah. I think independent artists mostly refers to the fact that they probably have to independently fund everything to happen, you know, or put the wheels in motion. But I think any successful artists will tell you that you still have to delegate. You cannot do it all yourself. So it's, it's only the quality of your team that you can put together.
That's that's gonna, um, as kind of, kind of take you
somewhere.
Rae Leigh: That is.
Really good advice.
I think. Um, all right. Well, I've pretty much finished questions. Do you have anything else you would like to share finish up
Shane Nicolson: Um, I don't think fun. It's been a fun. chat.
Rae Leigh: Good. Well, thank you so much for coming on. I'm finally got to have this chat with and just yeah. keep having fun stay positive and continue to be compassionate to yourself. During lockdown is hard. Um, I go crazy and I've only had like In In Queensland. So I have no idea guys are going through, but um, I hope I never do,
Shane Nicolson: I
Rae Leigh: I don't would survive. I don't have that personality type
Shane Nicolson: We'll look where it's where we're okay. Compared to Melbourne, you know, Victoria, they've done it even harder, so it's all relative. Um, yeah. So I agree. You look after yourself too. Congrats on this podcast, by the way.
Rae Leigh: Thank you. It's um, it was my way of staying sane during
Shane Nicolson: Whatever it takes
Rae Leigh: Yeah, but it's been good. It's been um, really healthy for me and really good way people and, and, continue to learn and gain from your, you know, experiences like we've shared. So really appreciate you being a part of it
Shane Nicolson: Oh, it's my pleasure. Thanks for having me. It's good to talk to you again.
Rae Leigh: Yeah, you too. Hopefully we'll get to um, catch up again soon, maybe at the dag one day, if it ever happens again.
Shane Nicolson: Yeah.
Rae Leigh: All right. Thank you
Shane Nicolson: Thank you. See you later.
